"So its a great show for feminism, but because it fails to adress racial issues it should be ignored and made to fail"
I’m just… going to repeat the first line here, and let it sit: “So it’s a great show for feminism, but because it fails to address racial issues.”
Motherfucker, HOW can ANYTHING be “great for feminism” if it “fails to address racial issues”?
I hate to inform you of this but WOMEN. OF. COLOR. EXIST.
What kind of feminism are you practicing, exactly?
If something “fails to address racial issues” it is AUTOMATICALLY bad feminism, bad on gender issues, bad for women. You CANNOT have feminism without antiracism, because “women” are a racialized group, and women face racism.
Like, jesus christ.
I just… I’m so stunned by this assertion that something can be “great for feminism” while failing on racial issues. Great for whose feminism, exactly? For white women’s feminism? Because I’m not playing the “we’ll get to women of color EVENTUALLY” game. That’s not feminism.
That’s white supremacy.
(I mean, literally. It’s “white people come first, and THEN we’ll deal with people of color’s issues. It is LITERALLY white supremacy)
"(it just ignores them, it doesnt introduce and then kill POCs left and right - hi joss)"
Y’all out there who think it’s somehow better to IGNORE people of color than to fridge them - you realize that ERASING people of color is violence, right?
Ignoring black and brown bodies is violent because it’s the kind of discursive and aesthetic rhetoric that ALLOWS us as a nation to ignore black and brown bodies in our public policy. Because we never see black and brown people in our culture, they’re never made human for us. We’re given tacit permission to never give a shit about them, which is why we don’t give a shit when they’re *literally* murdered through economic and state-sanctioned violence.
It’s not “better” to ignore racial issues than it is to “introduce and kill POC.” Neither of them is “better.” They’re both racist, they’re both forms of white supremacist violence.
But hey, AT LEAST the actors of color in Joss Whedon’s shows are getting PAID.
"It should be ignored and made to fail."
You realize no one is actively trying to make Agent Carter fail, right?
What I’ve seen is people on tumblr saying that we MUST watch Agent Carter because it’s SUCH a good show on feminism and social justice, and so anyone who cares about those issues MUST watch it.
And at a bunch of other people are pointing out that ACTUALLY, Agent Carter isn’t all that great on feminism and social justice.
If your premise is that I should watch Agent Carter because it’s “great on feminism,” then it better be fucking great on feminism. And it’s not.
Me pointing that out isn’t me trying to “make it fail.” No one is organizing a boycott. No one is writing letters to the TV studios trying to get it off air. We’re just resisting the idea that it’s the second coming of Social Justice TV (tm).
I love that refusing to buy into the logic that a show MUST be great social justice because it has a white female protagonist means we’re attacking it, and want it to die with fire. Please.
"Because what Marvel and other producers will take away from this is not "oh female super heroes suck"? We will get another show with a dude instead."
The fact that the entertainment industry takes the failure of female-led shows as a sign that ALL female-led shows suck is not our fault. That phenomenon is a product of misogyny, not of feminist not trying hard enough to make Peggy Carter a success.
We are not responsible as individuals for magically changing an institutional problem.
And the flip-side of this is that Peggy Carter succeeding does not automatically mean more female superheroes will appear. I remember a couple years ago with Bridesmaids, everyone was like “oh, you have to see this, or we’ll never get smart female comedies again!”
And Bridesmaids did really well… and we didn’t suddenly get an influx of smart female-led, female-written comedies. Because *misogyny* is the problem.
I happen to know that Marvel did a study after the release of Avengers to see what people thought of the characters, and two highest rated characters were the Hulk and Black Widow.
Guess who HASN’T gotten a movie?
Yeah, because actually, Marvel DOESN’T always listen to the market. Marvel doesn’t always listen to the fans. Marvel doesn’t always do what would make the most money. A lot of the time, Marvel will IGNORE THE EVIDENCE, because institutional oppression is not magically solved by capitalism,
It’s not that we’re not trying hard enough to promote female characters. Misogyny is the problem.
So please stop this bullshit guilt-tripping of people because they’re not watching #SolidarityIsForWhiteAgents.
"I mean discuss it with the creaters, criticize it but watch the show. so it can get better."
Ah, yes, I will just pick up my cellular telephone and call up the creators, who are close personal friends of mine, and tell them to cast Dichen Lachman, Q’orianka Kilcher, John Cho and Derek Luke. I don’t know why I didn’t think of that before! Racism solved.
I hate to burst your adorable innocent bubble, but people asking the entertainment industry to cast more people of color has not worked out very well so far.
Also, your logic is pretty classic abusive relationship logic. “Ah, yes, this show is terrible. But you must STAY WITH IT to make it better. ” Uh, no. No, I must not? The show is not going to get better because I watch it. It is not going to get better because it has higher ratings (if anything, that’ll convince the creators they’re doing something RIGHT). If I am not enjoying a show, for whatever reason, I am not obligated to stick around and “make it better” through the power of… osmosis, or something.
On a sidenote, I was totally planning to watch Agent Carter eventually, once grad school calmed down a bit. But defenders of the show trying to guilt trip people into watching it because it’s greatest thing for feminism since Margaret Sanger, and then responding to criticisms of the show’s supposed feminism with white supremacist logic of “it’s good for WOMEN and it’ll get better on people of color EVENTUALLY” is… really turning me off the idea.
If I ever needed more proof that Solidarity is For White Women, this discussion has been it.*
*(I didn’t need more proof)